Getting frustrated with bugs... 2005-06-03 - By Brent McPherson
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Joel,
If you can reproduce the bugs reliably then by all means send them in to
Softimage support. You should not necessarily assume it is graphics card
or hardware related.
As someone who has been in the software industry for longer than I care
to mention I can attest to the fact that new users often uncover
interesting bugs. This is because they often use a different workflow
from experienced users as they go through the experimentation and
learning phase. (i.e. which is a nice way of saying they tend to click
randomly all over the place in the software. ;-)
Also, the more precise steps you can provide to reproduce the bug (or
even provide a script if possible) will make it easier for us to
reproduce the bug and/or suggest a temporary workaround.
Thanks.
--
Brent
-- --Original Message-- --
From: owner-xsi@(protected) [mailto:owner-xsi@(protected)] On Behalf
Of Joel Blackwell
Sent: 03 June 2005 15:37
To: XSI@(protected)
Subject: Re: Getting frustrated with bugs...
Thanks for the additional replies, guys. One of the problems seems to
be- if I do exactly what I'm supposed to, XSI works okay. If I deviate,
even slightly, everything goes awry. It's a shame because I spend hours
in the manuals trying to work out if I've done something wrong, when
most of the time that weird thing I saw moments before really was a
'weird thing' after all.
When I said most guys have money to throw around, I was more referring
to the ability to get the right hardware for the job. Unfortunately,
I'll have to build a new rig for XSI, because I need my gamers card so I
can stay compatabile with the other programs I have related to game
development. It's a shame, but I guess that's the way the cookie
crumbles, as they say.
Hopefully in the future XSI's small quirks will be ironed out so I can
stop cowering in a corner, waiting for my computer to explode after
connecting a shader the way I'm not supposed to, or something.
-Joel
kim aldis wrote:
> There's a few things worth mentioning here:
>
> First, to re-iterate what has already been said here, that Xsi at 4.2
> is extremely stable and I rarely see it crash these days. One issue
> only these past 4 weeks and that I nailed down to a dodgy .mov file in
the roto view.
> Changed the roto file and all was dandy.
>
> Remember that graphics card issues are also related to any kind of
> picking so if you're having problems connecting RT nodes then this is
> likely a card issue. That said, I used the Go FX 5600 for quite some
> time without any major issues. I appreciate this isn't the same card
> but generally Nvidia is seen as good for xsi. Generally speaking,
> though, the best bet is to always go latest drivers and to get them
from Nvidia.
>
> Avoid recovering from crashed scenes. There's no guarantee that the
> saved scene is reliable and given the state of Xsi at the point of
> save it's highly likely to have some form of corruption. Many people
> here have reported instability issues with scenes that have been
> recovered. Far better to adopt a policy of regular saving.
>
>
> Remember that although Xsi is powerful and gives you a great deal of
> control over your work, that control comes with the penalty of
> complexity which in turn gives you greater scope for error.
>
>
> And finally, never underestimate the facility that sticky fingers and
> unfamiliarity have for making a mess of things without your realising
it.
>
>
>
>
> kim@(protected)
> kim@(protected)
>
>
>
>
>>-- --Original Message-- --
>>From: owner-xsi@(protected)
>>[mailto:owner-xsi@(protected)] On Behalf Of Joel Blackwell
>>Sent: 03 June 2005 13:59
>>To: XSI@(protected)
>>Subject: Re: Getting frustrated with bugs...
>>
>>Thanks to all who've posted responces so far... I appreciate it! It
>>was a little daft of me not to post some of the problems I'm having,
>>so I'll do so now.
>>
>>Firstly, I'm running a GeforceFX 5600 (and have run with a number of
>>different drivers.. currently the latest) I've had no major issues,
>>graphics wise.
>>
>>Now for some problems: Simple things, like creating two layers for a
>>simple shader, and then attaching a texture to each. Then, half of
>>the time I can't disconnect the textures at all from the layers
>>(mainly a problem for the tree view) and the other half of the time,
>>they do disconnect, but not visually, so I can't tell what's connected
>>to what until I hit refresh.
>>
>>Then (usually while trying to disconnect the textures from the first
>>problem) If I hit right mouse a few too many times in the tree view,
>>XSI crashes. Even though it tells me it successfully saves, when I
>>load XSI again and try to recover the scene, it tells me the scene is
>>the wrong version (version 420 or something along those lines) and
>>then proceeds to tell me it requires version 420. It then crashes
>>again.
>>
>>Here's one from XSIbase...
>>
>>I loaded in an X format model with textures (not made by
>>myself) and found it to have a red tint to it. I adjusted the ambient
>>lighting for the materials to grey, and wondered why, even though the
>>textures were grey in colour, the model still retained the red tint in
>>the 3D view.
>>However, the model rendered exactly as I thought it should look (that
>>is, with grey ambience). Long story short- after a lot of
>>experimentation, I found the problem to be that the model's texture
>>was connected to the diffuse port of the phong shader. I'd adjusted
>>the phong's ambience from red to grey, but XSI didn't change it fully.
>>If I disconnected the texture and reconnected it again, the ambience
>>was set back to red (again) and when I then changed it to grey, it
>>fixed the problem.
>>
>>Very strange, and for those wondering, I checked the scene ambience.
>>Really odd things like this keep popping up the more I work in the
>>render tree... weird anomalies that keep me busy for hours, rummaging
>>through the manual, trying to find out why it's happening.
>>
>>It's things like those that I encounter all over the place and make me
>>wonder if anyone bothered to test XSI at all before releasing it. I'm
>>sure that I'm overreacting somewhat at the moment... and you guys are
>>right, they're not the biggest problems in the world. But, it'd be
>>nice to have someone say, "Hey, we're going to get those things fixed,
>>so people don't start comparing XSI to Truespace 3!"
>>
>>-Joel
>>
>>
>>
>>Morten Bartholdy wrote:
>>
>>>Joel I do remember you ;) and I'm not sure my answer will
>>
>>be of much
>>
>>>help, but here goes:
>>>
>>>I use XSI on lots of different hardware combinations
>>
>>including a few
>>
>>>consumer gfxcards and though I do run in to the occasional bug or
>>>crash,
>>>V4.2 appears very stable for my use, which is any flavor of
>>
>>3D & VFX
>>
>>>for commercials and feature film alike. So I get around in
>>
>>the app and
>>
>>>I can't recognize your problems. I know this does not help
>>
>>you much,
>>
>>>but it leads me to think you are either suffering from a very
>>>incompatible gfxcard (you don't say which one), or bad
>>
>>hardware - perhaps memory.
>>
>>>You say it happens when working with shaders, so what
>>
>>exactly is it you do?
>>
>>>Do you tweak parameters on existing ones or write your own?
>>
>>Granted -
>>
>>>tweaking shaders with the renderregion active causes hangups or
>>>crashes now and then, but although annoying, nothing I would call
>>>serious flaws. The only times I have experienced repeated
>>
>>crashes or
>>
>>>the like, was when I was beating what ought to be a dead horse, and
>>>was too tired to think of reasonable workarounds or even a better
>>>solution. In my experience (having taught 3D at several
>>
>>schools in my
>>
>>>country) those that keep running into trouble with the app
>>
>>often keep
>>
>>>using it in ways that may provoke certain weaknesses in the
>>
>>sw. I am
>>
>>>not saying that is what you do - I am only trying to give
>>
>>you pointers regarding how to work on fixing your specific problem.
>>
>>>When you say no-one seems to care about your problems, bear in mind
>>>that if it is a gfxcard issue, it could be fixed for an amount
>>>equalling a few hours work for many professionals on this,
>>
>>and though
>>
>>>I understand your pain, and appreciate that you may not be in a
>>>position to aquire a certified card, you may need to
>>
>>understand why others might not be bothered.
>>
>>>You might get more help from some of all the good guys
>>
>>residing here
>>
>>>if you provide a bit more specific info about the nature of your
>>>predicament. I am no hardware expert, but I have used XSI
>>
>>on several
>>
>>>consumer cards including even an old GeForce 2 GTS, and apart from
>>>performance and OGL accuracy they are not much different from
>>>Wildcats, Fire or nVidia FX cards for average daily use, so
>>
>>I am curious to know which card you are using.
>>
>>>
>>>Best regards
>>>
>>>Morten Bartholdy
>>>3D & VFX Artist
>>>Denmark
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>-- -- Original Message -- --
>>>From: "Joel Blackwell" <joel@(protected)>
>>>To: <XSI@(protected)>
>>>Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 12:39 PM
>>>Subject: Getting frustrated with bugs...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>I'm considering selling XSI, mainly because I'm finding it hard to
>>>>learn the program, due to the fact I run into a bug every
>>
>>few minutes
>>
>>>>when working with shaders. Every time I post about the
>>
>>problems (on a
>>
>>>>forum), someone pipes up and tells me something like, "You
>>
>>must have
>>
>>>>missed something." or, "The problem must be with your
>>
>>graphics card."
>>
>>>>Perhaps either one of those could be true, since I'm not using a
>>>>certified card, and I'm no XSI know-it-all. However, no
>>
>>one seems to
>>
>>>>care if the problem could actually be worth looking to. My
>>
>>posts just
>>
>>>>disappear into nothingness, never to be seen again. Seemingly, my
>>>>only solution I have is- risk paying some money for a
>>
>>certified card
>>
>>>>(which is beyond my price range at the moment) that may not fix the
>>>>problems I've been seeing anyway.
>>>>
>>>>This is obviously a great community for people who work in a
>>>>professional environment, and have money to throw around everywhere
>>>>for proper support and the hardware to suit a professional
>>
>>pipeline.
>>
>>>>But, for people like myself, XSI seems more and more the poorer
>>>>program to go with. Softimage may be doing everything they can to
>>>>increase their userbase, but the program just isn't
>>
>>designed for the average person...
>>
>>>>and right now, I wouldn't recommend it to anyone. I mean,
>>
>>why develop
>>
>>>>a program for certified (non-gamer) cards, and then aim the
>>
>>program at
>>
>>>>mod makers for games? It just doesn't make any sense.
>>>>
>>>>That aside, does anyone have some advice for me? Last time
>>
>>I posted
>>
>>>>on this mailing list everyone tried to kill me as the marauding
>>>>invader from the land of Truespace (if anyone remembers
>>
>>that fiasco).
>>
>>>>This time, I'm hopeful that won't happen again, and someone
>>
>>will help
>>
>>>>me get this program working as it should. Or, the
>>
>>Softimage crew will
>>
>>>>actually note down some bugs to be fixed, so I don't have
>>
>>to sell XSI
>>
>>>>and move onto something that works.
>>>>
>>>>Thanks.
>>>>
>>>>-Joel
>>>>---
>>>>Unsubscribe? Mail Majordomo@(protected) with the
>>
>>following text in body:
>>
>>>>unsubscribe xsi
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
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>>
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>>>
>>
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>
>
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