 | | | Cloth | Cloth 2005-04-02 - By Brad Friedman
Back
making the cloth is really easy in syflex. The hard part is getting it
to sit in a stable manner on your character. Its tough to get it to
move without getting caught in seams, or generally flaking out. Pins
and such are usually the way to go. Its possible and it works with the
2.x syflex for XSI. But if the featureset for 3.0 is what its supposed
to be, it should be a lot easier now than it was previously.
Actually... even the improvements in the pin from XSI 4.0 to 4.2 were
enough to make things easier.
However, if you are looking for a solution thats going to let you
arbitrarily cloth up your characters for general purpose long form
animation work, that may be unrealistic to expect of stock syflex or
maya cloth at this point. Its not that they couldn't do the
simulation. Its just that they generate so much simulation work... the
budget for the cloth sim department would need to be rather large. My
recollection is that PDI relies heavily on their finishing department to
deform simulation flubs out of their cloth simulations by hand. This is
part of their proprietary pipeline. But thats what they kinda had to do
to make it work for their needs.
The pixar solution is interesting. Hearing about it reminds me of
something somebody was doing with a script I wrote.
This is the addon:
http://xsi.fie.us/orientationDrivenShapes/
Its just a reworking of linking shapes to orientations. nothing
special. What was kind of cool was a guy on XSIBase who's alias is
"milesc". He was playing around with it and was baking out shapes from
a cloth sim at different poses and using my addon to drive the shapes.
The way the article talks about how pixar is doing their thing sounds
different... much more sophisticated... but I was reminded of what
milesc was doing none the less.
If I were to take on a project with fully clothed characters at this
point I'd put some R&D time into something similar to what milesc was
doing. I figure if it works, it can probably take care of the bulk of
the clothing shots, leaving just the ones that really have to be
simulated, for a full simulation.
just my 2 cents plus a few ramblings
-brad
john clark wrote:
> I'm only going from what I saw in the documentary which was clearly
> Maya cloth. Obviously it may be that it was Maya sitting on top of
> some of their own stuff. Like you say it may be that it was just for
> assembly. Whatever it was I'm still quite interested to know whether
> people have attempted to make clothes with syflex and how they got on.
>
> john
> -- -- Original Message -- --
>
> *From:* Brad Friedman <mailto:xsibrad@(protected)>
> *To:* XSI@(protected) <mailto:XSI@(protected)>
> *Sent:* Saturday, April 02, 2005 7:04 PM
> *Subject:* Re: Cloth
>
> everything I've read says they may have used maya for some
> clothing assembly but the actual cloth sim was proprietary.
>
> note:
>
> http://cgw.pennnet.com/Articles/Article_Display.cfm?Section=Articles
&Subsection=Display&ARTICLE_ID=215639
>
> which has a short explanation.
>
> My recollection is that pixar was doing their own cloth sim as far
> back as "Geri's Game".
>
> -brad
>
> Steven Caron wrote:
>
>>they didn't use a proprietary cloth solution?
>>
>>On Apr 2, 2005 5:08 AM, john clark <john.clark23@(protected)> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>>Hi all
>>>
>>>I've never used any cloth simulation stuff but yesterday I watched 'The
>>>making of the incredibles' and noticed that they used Maya's cloth for the
>>>clothes which surprised me 'cos I'd always assumed that it was incredibly
>>>slow, but it got me wondering about making clothes. All entirely academic
>>>since I work in games with Maya, and cloth simulations are not very
>>>real-time! But I wondered what syflex was like and whether you could make
>>>shirts and jackets with it easily. Has anyone used it for that sort of
>>>stuff? What's it like?
>>>
>>>cheers
>>>
>>>John
>>>
>>>
>>---
>>Unsubscribe? Mail Majordomo@(protected) with the following text in body:
>>unsubscribe xsi
>>
>>
>
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making the cloth is really easy in syflex. The hard part is getting it
to sit in a stable manner on your character. Its tough to get it to
move without getting caught in seams, or generally flaking out. Pins
and such are usually the way to go. Its possible and it works with the
2.x syflex for XSI. But if the featureset for 3.0 is what its supposed
to be, it should be a lot easier now than it was previously.
Actually... even the improvements in the pin from XSI 4.0 to 4.2 were
enough to make things easier.<br>
<br>
However, if you are looking for a solution thats going to let you
arbitrarily cloth up your characters for general purpose long form
animation work, that may be unrealistic to expect of stock syflex or
maya cloth at this point. Its not that they couldn't do the
simulation. Its just that they generate so much simulation work... the
budget for the cloth sim department would need to be rather large. My
recollection is that PDI relies heavily on their finishing department
to deform simulation flubs out of their cloth simulations by hand.
This is part of their proprietary pipeline. But thats what they kinda
had to do to make it work for their needs.<br>
<br>
The pixar solution is interesting. Hearing about it reminds me of
something somebody was doing with a script I wrote.<br>
<br>
This is the addon:<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://xsi.fie.us
/orientationDrivenShapes/">http://xsi.fie.us/orientationDrivenShapes/</a><br>
<br>
Its just a reworking of linking shapes to orientations. nothing
special. What was kind of cool was a guy on XSIBase who's alias is
"milesc". He was playing around with it and was baking out shapes from
a cloth sim at different poses and using my addon to drive the shapes.
The way the article talks about how pixar is doing their thing sounds
different... much more sophisticated... but I was reminded of what
milesc was doing none the less.<br>
<br>
If I were to take on a project with fully clothed characters at this
point I'd put some R&D time into something similar to what milesc
was doing. I figure if it works, it can probably take care of the bulk
of the clothing shots, leaving just the ones that really have to be
simulated, for a full simulation.<br>
<br>
just my 2 cents plus a few ramblings<br>
<br>
-brad<br>
<br>
john clark wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid005d01c537b7$2dbe8290$ca970052@(protected)"
type="cite">
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<div><font face="Arial" size="2">I'm only going from what I saw in
the documentary which was clearly Maya cloth. Obviously it may be that
it was Maya sitting on top of some of their own stuff. Like you say it
may be that it was just for assembly. Whatever it was I'm still quite
interested to know whether people have attempted to make clothes with
syflex and how they got on.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">john</font></div>
<div>-- -- Original Message -- -- </div>
<blockquote
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-right: 0px; padding-left:
5px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;">
<div
style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228) none repeat scroll 0%; -moz-background
-clip: initial; -moz-background-origin: initial; -moz-background-inline-policy:
initial; font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font
-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none;
font-stretch: normal;"><b>From:</b>
<a title="xsibrad@(protected)" href="mailto:xsibrad@(protected)">Brad Friedman</a>
</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font
-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none;
font-stretch: normal;"><b>To:</b>
<a title="XSI@(protected)" href="mailto:XSI@(protected)">XSI@(protected)
.COM</a>
</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font
-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none;
font-stretch: normal;"><b>Sent:</b>
Saturday, April 02, 2005 7:04 PM</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font
-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none;
font-stretch: normal;"><b>Subject:</b>
Re: Cloth</div>
<div><br>
</div>
everything I've read says they may have used maya for some clothing
assembly but the actual cloth sim was proprietary.<br>
<br>
note:<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://cgw.pennnet.com/Articles/Article_Display.cfm?Section=Articles&
;Subsection=Display&ARTICLE_ID=215639">http://cgw.pennnet.com/Articles
/Article_Display.cfm?Section=Articles&Subsection=Display&ARTICLE_ID
=215639</a><br>
<br>
which has a short explanation.<br>
<br>
My recollection is that pixar was doing their own cloth sim as far back
as "Geri's Game".<br>
<br>
-brad<br>
<br>
Steven Caron wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid3167b41105040209294f1ccb25@(protected)"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">they didn't use a proprietary cloth solution?
On Apr 2, 2005 5:08 AM, john clark <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:john.clark23@(protected)"><john.clark23@(protected)></a>
wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">
Hi all
I've never used any cloth simulation stuff but yesterday I watched 'The
making of the incredibles' and noticed that they used Maya's cloth for the
clothes which surprised me 'cos I'd always assumed that it was incredibly
slow, but it got me wondering about making clothes. All entirely academic
since I work in games with Maya, and cloth simulations are not very
real-time! But I wondered what syflex was like and whether you could make
shirts and jackets with it easily. Has anyone used it for that sort of
stuff? What's it like?
cheers
John
</pre>
</blockquote>
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