 | | | AA and motion blurring a depth pass or not (was RE: DOF and Depth Pass probl | AA and motion blurring a depth pass or not (was RE: DOF and Depth Pass probl 2005-03-22 - By Brad Friedman
Back
The famed "Matrix super punch" would qualify. Extreme foreground and
background. shallow depth of field throwing a lot out of focus. many
semi transparent objects all over (the rain and water). Pretty extreme
camera move which should cause some MB. But I guess thats why they used
the mental ray physically accurate solution for that shot.
I would think most jib arm camera moves with foreground and background
would produce situations where you'd need both DOF and MB to work well
together.
Morten Bartholdy wrote:
>I haven't run into a situation yet, so your point about those situations
>being rare probably holds true :)
>
>I have pondered over it though, in order to know a way to deal with it
>should it occur one day. If I were to point out a possible scenario it might
>be a bird flapping its wings flying from out of focus, say in the extreme
>foreground and into focus or vice versa. You would need motion blur
>especially because of the flapping wings and the degree of focus on the bird
>would definately have to be more or less correct - possibly animated, all
>dependant on the applied solution.
>
>The bird would primarily show much motion blurring on the wings, meaning the
>body may not be terribly blurred before applying out of focus DOF to it.
>
>Still you are right - those occasions would probably be rare indeed.
>
>--
>
>Morten Bartholdy | morten@(protected)
>Denmark
>
>
>-- -- Original Message -- --
>From: "Raffaele "ThE_JacO" Fragapane" <jaco@(protected)>
>To: <XSI@(protected)>
>Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 4:49 PM
>Subject: RE: AA and motion blurring a depth pass or not (was RE: DOF and
>Depth Pass problem)
>
>
>
>
>>I've been with you on most of this, but I fear I sort of lost you here :)
>>Could you provide an example of a situation where you had problems
>>
>>
>combining
>
>
>>the two and it would look weird?
>>
>>I'm also afraid my perspective is a bit narrow, as I've always only worked
>>on filmwork or mixed liveaction+CG commercials, so I can't picture clearly
>>cases (like titling, fully CGmovies, logos etc.) where these issues are
>>detached from reality and, I'm sure, become more relevant.
>>
>>I've also found that I hardly ever need moblur and precise DOF in the same
>>background, to get that kind of effect you'd need a pretty weird camera
>>setup in real life, and if the whole BG is moving that much (either
>>
>>
>because
>
>
>>of the camera move or because it's actually moving objects) moblur will be
>>so field filling that a normal blur will do the trick, without going into
>>the kind of circle of confusion meldy blur that detailed DOF needs.
>>
>>~Raffaele Fragapane
>>~Lead "I'm sure we can make it work"
>>~Peerless Camera Company
>>
>>
>>-- --Original Message-- --
>>From: owner-xsi@(protected) [mailto:owner-xsi@(protected)] On Behalf
>>
>>
>Of
>
>
>>Morten Bartholdy
>>Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 3:53 PM
>>To: XSI@(protected)
>>Subject: Re: AA and motion blurring a depth pass or not (was RE: DOF and
>>Depth Pass problem)
>>
>>True Raffaele - and for transparent obejcts this is true also. Still with
>>
>>
>FG
>
>
>>and BG split into separate passes there seems to be no cheap solution to
>>adding DOF to motionblurred material that I've heard of, except for those
>>situations where depth in a given pass can be ignored and a fixed out of
>>focus filter can be applied to the separate passes. Any suggestions?
>>
>>--
>>
>>Morten Bartholdy | morten@(protected)
>>Denmark
>>
>>
>>-- -- Original Message -- --
>>From: "Raffaele "ThE_JacO" Fragapane" <jaco@(protected)>
>>To: <XSI@(protected)>
>>Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 2:23 PM
>>Subject: RE: AA and motion blurring a depth pass or not (was RE: DOF and
>>Depth Pass problem)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>The one thing I think is missing is the context.
>>>
>>>when would you have a situation where you need a unified depth pass for
>>>
>>>
>a
>
>
>>>quickly moving motion blurred foreground AND a moving motion blurred
>>>background?
>>>
>>>In those cases you usually isolate the depth passes for the foreground
>>>
>>>
>and
>
>
>>>background elements to have more range and control on individual items,
>>>
>>>
>>and
>>
>>
>>>in that case the artifacts of BG VS FG will not matter since what you
>>>
>>>
>are
>
>
>>>doing happens in the object/bundle of objects in the respective layers.
>>>
>>>There sure are situations where these issues may arise, but they seem to
>>>
>>>
>>be
>>
>>
>>>mostly exceptions since most times you have a hero in foreground on a
>>>
>>>
>shot
>
>
>>>plate and only additional props or photogrammetry on the back place.
>>>
>>>If we consider a single beauty for all the elements, or fully CGmovies
>>>rendered in one huge go, I'll agree; but how common a situation is
>>>
>>>
>that?
>
>
>>>Passes should be sensibly used to split FG and BG layers as well, and in
>>>that case you want individual depth passes.
>>>
>>>~Raffaele Fragapane
>>>~Lead "I'm sure we can make it work"
>>>~Peerless Camera Company
>>>
>>>
>>---
>>Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
>>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
>>Version: 6.0.799 / Virus Database: 543 - Release Date: 19-Nov-04 (See http://Nov-04.ora-code.com)
>>
>>
>>---
>>Unsubscribe? Mail Majordomo@(protected) with the following text in body:
>>unsubscribe xsi
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>---
>Unsubscribe? Mail Majordomo@(protected) with the following text in body:
>unsubscribe xsi
>
>
<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html;charset=windows-1252 (See http://ows-1252.ora-code.com)"
http-equiv="Content-Type">
<title></title>
</head>
<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
The famed "Matrix super punch" would qualify. Extreme foreground and
background. shallow depth of field throwing a lot out of focus. many
semi transparent objects all over (the rain and water). Pretty extreme
camera move which should cause some MB. But I guess thats why they
used the mental ray physically accurate solution for that shot.<br>
<br>
I would think most jib arm camera moves with foreground and background
would produce situations where you'd need both DOF and MB to work well
together.<br>
<br>
<br>
Morten Bartholdy wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid001b01c52f2f$18b6d1d0$0300000a@(protected)"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">I haven't run into a situation yet, so your point about those
situations
being rare probably holds true :)
I have pondered over it though, in order to know a way to deal with it
should it occur one day. If I were to point out a possible scenario it might
be a bird flapping its wings flying from out of focus, say in the extreme
foreground and into focus or vice versa. You would need motion blur
especially because of the flapping wings and the degree of focus on the bird
would definately have to be more or less correct - possibly animated, all
dependant on the applied solution.
The bird would primarily show much motion blurring on the wings, meaning the
body may not be terribly blurred before applying out of focus DOF to it.
Still you are right - those occasions would probably be rare indeed.
--
Morten Bartholdy | <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:morten
@(protected)">morten@(protected)</a>
Denmark
-- -- Original Message -- --
From: "Raffaele "ThE_JacO" Fragapane" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href=
"mailto:jaco@(protected)"><jaco@(protected)></a>
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:XSI@(protected)"><XSI
@(protected)></a>
Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 4:49 PM
Subject: RE: AA and motion blurring a depth pass or not (was RE: DOF and
Depth Pass problem)
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">I've been with you on most of this, but I fear I sort of lost
you here :)
Could you provide an example of a situation where you had problems
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->combining
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">the two and it would look weird?
I'm also afraid my perspective is a bit narrow, as I've always only worked
on filmwork or mixed liveaction+CG commercials, so I can't picture clearly
cases (like titling, fully CGmovies, logos etc.) where these issues are
detached from reality and, I'm sure, become more relevant.
I've also found that I hardly ever need moblur and precise DOF in the same
background, to get that kind of effect you'd need a pretty weird camera
setup in real life, and if the whole BG is moving that much (either
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->because
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">of the camera move or because it's actually moving objects)
moblur will be
so field filling that a normal blur will do the trick, without going into
the kind of circle of confusion meldy blur that detailed DOF needs.
~Raffaele Fragapane
~Lead "I'm sure we can make it work"
~Peerless Camera Company
-- --Original Message-- --
From: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:owner-xsi@(protected)"
>owner-xsi@(protected)</a> [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto
:owner-xsi@(protected)">mailto:owner-xsi@(protected)</a>] On Behalf
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->Of
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Morten Bartholdy
Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 3:53 PM
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:XSI@(protected)">XSI
@(protected)</a>
Subject: Re: AA and motion blurring a depth pass or not (was RE: DOF and
Depth Pass problem)
True Raffaele - and for transparent obejcts this is true also. Still with
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->FG
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">and BG split into separate passes there seems to be no cheap
solution to
adding DOF to motionblurred material that I've heard of, except for those
situations where depth in a given pass can be ignored and a fixed out of
focus filter can be applied to the separate passes. Any suggestions?
--
Morten Bartholdy | <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:morten
@(protected)">morten@(protected)</a>
Denmark
-- -- Original Message -- --
From: "Raffaele "ThE_JacO" Fragapane" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href=
"mailto:jaco@(protected)"><jaco@(protected)></a>
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:XSI@(protected)"><XSI
@(protected)></a>
Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 2:23 PM
Subject: RE: AA and motion blurring a depth pass or not (was RE: DOF and
Depth Pass problem)
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">The one thing I think is missing is the context.
when would you have a situation where you need a unified depth pass for
</pre>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->a
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">quickly moving motion blurred foreground AND a moving motion
blurred
background?
In those cases you usually isolate the depth passes for the foreground
</pre>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->and
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">background elements to have more range and control on
individual items,
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">and
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">in that case the artifacts of BG VS FG will not matter since
what you
</pre>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->are
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">doing happens in the object/bundle of objects in the
respective layers.
There sure are situations where these issues may arise, but they seem to
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">be
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">mostly exceptions since most times you have a hero in
foreground on a
</pre>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->shot
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">plate and only additional props or photogrammetry on the
back place.
If we consider a single beauty for all the elements, or fully CGmovies
rendered in one huge go, I'll agree; but how common a situation is
</pre>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->that?
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Passes should be sensibly used to split FG and BG layers as
well, and in
that case you want individual depth passes.
~Raffaele Fragapane
~Lead "I'm sure we can make it work"
~Peerless Camera Company
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http:/
/www.grisoft.com">http://www.grisoft.com</a>).
Version: 6.0.799 / Virus Database: 543 - Release Date: 19-Nov-04 (See http://Nov-04.ora-code.com)
---
Unsubscribe? Mail <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Majordomo
@(protected)">Majordomo@(protected)</a> with the following text in body:
unsubscribe xsi
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
---
Unsubscribe? Mail <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Majordomo
@(protected)">Majordomo@(protected)</a> with the following text in body:
unsubscribe xsi
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>
|
|
|